Episode #5 - Resilience & Efficiency: The Human Advantage in the Age of AI w/ Sam Chandler

Full Episode Transcript

This is the full recorded conversation from The Human Protocol Podcast, published by The Human Protocol Group. © 2026 The Human Protocol Group. Please link to and attribute the original episode when referencing this conversation.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (00:03.202)
We are at a real turning point where companies write algorithms, governments write laws, but someone has to write about the human story. And this is what this space is and will be about. Welcome everyone to The Human Protocol. I'm your host, Mykel Salomon. We talk about AI, leadership, and humanity. Not in theory.

but in how it reshapes our everyday lives. Today we have a very exciting guest with us. I'm joined by Sam Chandler, who is a customer retention and engagement expert, who has been featured in a variety of articles, podcasts, and digital marketing campaigns about all aspects of concepts of user experience, the psychological drivers behind consumer behavior,

and how AI will impact consumer expectations. Sam has advised hundreds of companies from early stage startups through Fortune 500 corporations on launching go-to-market strategies that rely on driving engagement to drive revenue and was named as the top voice in customer retention and startups development by LinkedIn. She thrives on building highly-

capable and diverse teams, and is incredibly proud to have helped dozens of her reports advance into senior positions and into senior leadership roles. Sam, my friend, welcome to the Human Protocol.

Sam Chandler (01:43.382)
Thank you so much for having me. I am so honored to be here and this is just such a wonderful, wonderful idea. Thank you for having me.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (01:52.852)
Awesome. I do appreciate you jumping on this with me and making time of your very busy schedule to have this conversation with us today, right? Because as I mentioned to you, this is our space. And I hope this conversation sparks interest and people can connect to it in the future. And in this episode, right, as we previously discussed, we're going to talk about what is really the human advantage.

in a time of AI acceleration and how to retain customers by building trust and how to build those resilient teams over efficient ones and why human connection is really still the ultimate metric that we all should pursue. And I would like to kick things off, Sam, with a question that I ask every single guest, which is when we remove the titles, the LinkedIn bio,

Who is Sam at her core?

Sam Chandler (02:57.514)
Such a great question. Who is Sam? You know, I think at the core, just, try to be authentic. I try to be authentic. So weird, very weird, authentically weird. And I try to, I just, yeah, I'm just trying to think through, like, I don't necessarily.

think I am anything, I just try to be things with my actions. And I think that's, we're all the sum of our choices, our actions, and the roads we take. And so I just try to be as weirdly authentic, authentically weird, and pull as many people along with me as I can.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (03:30.264)
Mm-hmm.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (03:49.804)
Yeah, that's beautiful. Thanks for sharing that,

Sam Chandler (03:53.174)
Thanks. That sounded really fancy. I also am, I'm fueled by Red Bull, sugar-free Red Bull. So it's like 50 % philosophy and then 50 % sugar-free Red Bull. Yeah. Yeah.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (04:00.078)
The balance, right? The yin and the yang, right?

Sam Chandler (04:10.518)
Absolutely.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (04:13.038)
It's interesting because when we were discussing, Sam and I, were discussing what would be that topic that we should be talking about, right? And we started talking, yes, AI, and there's a lot of conversation about efficiency gains, and everybody's just talking about efficiency. How this metric improve? How is AI making this more efficient, right? But then you told me,

I think we should talk about the resilience, right? Because that's not something that we talk about every day. And we should talk about what makes us resilient humans more than what make us efficient. And when you told me that, I'd say, yes, this is definitely something that we should be discussing about. And I think that you are very passionate about, which is the resilience in human beings, right? And how this is our

actually human advantage in times of AI.

Sam Chandler (05:15.784)
is absolutely correct. know, we, efficiency is all we talk about as it pertains to AI. How can we be so much more efficient and get things done in the day and look how much more productive I was. And what's interesting is like, as I've, I've heard, you know, the, progression of, AI into our lives, you know, over the last couple of years, and everybody's talking about efficiency, I step back and I think about resilience. So.

the difference between efficiency and resilience is, know, like as humans building these systems, these processes, economics, computers, science, math, it's about how can you get things faster? How can you create short-term gains? Nature on the other hand, resilience is what nature values because

You if you think about different examples in nature where resilience is key and resilience is built, there's this really fascinating example. There was an experiment in the eighties called Biosphere 2, and they tried to grow plants in a perfect environment. had like a dome, nothing could get at it. And all of the trees that they grew,

they actually ended up falling down and they were so confused. Scientists couldn't figure out what was going on. And they realized it's because there's something called stress wood that is developed on trees when they are faced with their version of adversity. So things like wind and they have to develop the strength to actually, you know, fight, fight back on, those things in their environment survive. Absolutely. And so that's why in, in nature,

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (06:41.858)
Hmm.

Sam Chandler (07:08.102)
in humans and our development, resilience is such a more impactful quality that is sought after than efficiency, which creates more brittle systems, which might be faster, but definitely are not as strong. So that's what I think of as I think about this latest push into AI. It's important. It's a huge development for humanity, whether you want to be involved or not. But the thing that

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (07:33.006)
you

Sam Chandler (07:36.608)
that makes us human and will continue to make us important in this world is our ability to face adversity, to be resilient, and to keep going.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (07:49.998)
Right, right, to keep going. Thanks for putting that so beautifully, because it's really what makes us humans being humans, right? And through centuries, we have developed, through different stages of human evolution, ways for us to adapt, reinvent ourselves, right? And through resilience, we can survive, right? Events that we have been exposed to.

Sam Chandler (08:00.694)
Absolutely.

Sam Chandler (08:16.758)
Absolutely.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (08:18.956)
So I think it's definitely something that we all should be talking more as we try to focus on our humanity, what makes us humans more and more.

Perfect. Sam, let's talk about what drew you to customer success.

Sam Chandler (08:38.24)
Let's talk about what drew you to customer success. Yeah, yeah. it was, I don't know if I was drawn to it or if it was drawn to me. And it just so, it so happened that way. I came to customer success by way of being in the world of CX. from, I think about my earliest career moves.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (08:52.428)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (09:06.87)
my earliest jobs, it was always customer facing. And then I ended up building out CX systems for startups. And then through that, I made my way into customer success because I was able to explain the systems and walk the walk for the customers that I was helping. it kind of, I was led into it.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (09:34.67)
Hmm.

Sam Chandler (09:34.94)
in a very natural way. then basically through that, I started exploring and just realizing like, there's very interesting patterns here to explore. So yeah, that's pretty much how it happened. Interesting, interesting. And you're talking about patterns.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (09:48.32)
Interesting, interesting. And you're talking about patterns and I know you're very passionate about understanding the psychology of engagement, right? And what about that?

Sam Chandler (09:55.031)
understanding the psychology of engagement, right? Yeah. What about that? Yeah. So, know, customer success is a great example of one of the things that I hate, that annoys the crap out of me is when we measure engagement by how many times we've reached out to somebody. And I sit here and I think about like all of the teams that get measured by that and how

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (10:17.677)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (10:24.06)
many people have, have like celebrated the fact that they sent out a thousand emails. And I'm like, well, is that really our job or is our job to like connect with people and get them to the next phase of, you know, helping themselves with the product that they just bought. So for me, I started like really digging in really researching what, gets people to engage with you? Like, is it, is it having a one-on-one meeting? Are there other little things that people are doing?

before that, that we should really be picking up on and celebrating more. So that's where I started getting into, this is really nerdy, but I started getting into the science of forming habits. And I started thinking, can we leverage these same concepts to better measure whether we're doing a good job or not at what we're doing? And then also, how can we

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (11:06.286)
Hmm.

Sam Chandler (11:23.618)
how can we start measuring those successes and seeing those indicators as a way to progress the relationship forward? So after I started really shifting towards that, I realized it's been a decade now of doing that. But studying that, especially as we layer on this AI element of it, it's been really, really interesting to just see how it brought...

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (11:39.854)
you

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (11:45.87)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (11:51.415)
add so much depth to a relationship if you think of it like that instead of, know, oh, I'm trying to send the emails to somebody. Let's see if they answer. No, like what are we inherently trying to help this person with? Not even just like, oh, they need to use this product, but what will that help them do? Okay, well, it can help them exceed in their job, okay, well, will that help them do? Maybe get a raise. Okay, what will that help them do? Make them feel better about themselves. So like,

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (12:00.429)
Right.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (12:19.404)
Where is the value, Ryan?

Sam Chandler (12:20.95)
Exactly. Like you center it back on the person and truly like what do they need inherently? Like what is the internal trigger for them doing this? And it just opens up a such an interesting world of possibilities and how you can reshape the way that you work. Yeah, I can agree. I can agree more. a and it makes me think how have you seen especially in the past two years

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (12:36.494)
Yeah, I can agree. I can agree more. It makes me think how have you seen, especially in the past two years and currently, how AI is driving customer expectations and changing customer expectations, especially because of AI.

Sam Chandler (12:46.878)
is driving customer expectations and changing customer expectations, especially because of AI. Yeah. You know what's super interesting is like, if I talk to consumers, like the end user of the AI experience, they don't care at all. And why should they? At the end of the day, like the problem is the same, whether it is, you know, you're using AI as the tool or a knowledge base.

Customers and consumers and users, they just want their question answered very quickly. If we can do that with AI, awesome. If we can do it without AI, great. They don't care. What I have noticed though is the shift in AI really is beneficial to businesses. it helps, it should, when done correctly, help a company help their customers in a more efficient way.

And that's a time where efficiency really is a good thing as opposed to resilience, which is also good.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (13:53.24)
Right, so how do you see what companies, and not all companies of course, some companies are getting wrong when they're measuring more efficiency instead of empathy, for example.

Sam Chandler (13:55.058)
see what companies and not all companies of course

Sam Chandler (14:06.613)
Yeah, empathy is a really important word in this. You know, I think back to all of the ways that companies can get support wrong in general, even before AI was in our lives, not listening to the customer, not understanding the sentiment of, you know, what I'm telling you. That's really where I see companies get it wrong. For example, you know, like having an off ramp.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (14:25.346)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (14:35.195)
on an AI conversation. If a customer is not, like if it's just not meshing, if the customer is not interacting with the bot, they're not understanding what the bot's not understanding what the customer needs, then just let them talk to an agent. Like that's not more efficient if you lose the customer in the process. understanding like it's not just about that one specific support metric, but

how is this entire ecosystem impacting your bottom line, your retention numbers, even your acquisition numbers, depending on where you're using AI. That's where I see like just short-sightedness, getting the better of companies and them losing what they sought out to get. Yeah, I think there is a race.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (15:17.005)
Yeah.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (15:20.812)
Yeah, think there is a race for searching the best number, right? That AI can help with efficiency instead of trying to really understand what is the best value that you can offer to your customer and how AI can help you with. And it's also, know in the community that we belong to, a lot of people are navigating.

Sam Chandler (15:42.711)
A lot of people are navigating these waters of trying to implement AI into their daily operations, right? Absolutely. And debating what is it to be automated versus what's not. Yes. And, you know, I think back to when I used to advise startups and I think back to Paul Graham from YC and he has this beautiful

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (15:46.178)
these waters of trying to implement AI into their daily operations, right? And debating what is it to be automated versus what's not.

Sam Chandler (16:10.335)
essay that he's written about doing things that don't scale. so, and when I think about automation and how like you have the ability to be a differentiator by being able to add those human touches that your competitors who maybe are bigger, they don't have the ability to do that anymore. So sometimes it seems counterintuitive, but if you can do things that don't scale, you know, he...

points out that maybe it can scale longer than what you think. And so I always used to remind my founders that I would talk to you, don't automate yourself out of your differentiator because if that like, that's great, you know, that you can create a workflow that means you never have to talk to a human soul for the rest of your life. That's fantastic. But like, if, if it's for some, it might be, but, if it's, if it's keeping you from the

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (16:59.342)
you

Sam Chandler (17:07.659)
the from being that that new disruptor in the market, then what are you doing? Like, is that really better for you than than like figuring out a way to maintain the humanity within your company and differentiating where your competitors cannot?

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (17:28.814)
Yeah, it's all about trying to keep that empathy in every aspect of your operations, right? From your decision making to your conversation with your direct reports and how we can continue to build these automations and systems that can add value in a way that still keep us humans in the middle of this conversation, right?

Sam Chandler (17:35.049)
Absolutely.

and how we can continue to build these automations and systems that can add value in a way that is still keep those humans in the middle of this conversation, right? Absolutely, yeah. You know, I mean, I'm not the first one to say it, I won't be the last. Like there are things that humans can do that at least as of right now, robots still can't do.

So I'm going to be hitching my wagon on those things. the strategic thoughts, the understanding, the context of what people are saying, the tone, those are things that we can code into a bot, but we can actually feel them. And it's similar to reading a script versus saying the thing.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (18:07.758)
Mm-hmm.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (18:33.354)
and feeling it, right?

Sam Chandler (18:34.039)
feeling it. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So, you know, I think through the the different types of intelligence. So a lot of people are thinking that emotional intelligence, that's what we need right now, you know, EQ and that's what's going to set us apart. I would also argue that at the adversity quotient, a Q is also going to be hugely important as well. We think through

resilience versus efficiency and being able to think through the long game, which is something that our efficient algorithms are not necessarily set up to do right now. So I think that that's going to be where humans come in and make sure that we maintain humanity when we're talking to each other. Because otherwise, what is the point? We have bots talking to one another. What is good about that? hopefully there will always be a place for us.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (19:25.294)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (19:30.979)
in the world that we built.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (19:32.62)
Yeah, that's the hope. I know that we both share that, right? That we still keep in humans at the center of this conversation. But this is a disruptive technology, right? It really is. And we're going to see disruption. And the topic and the title of this episode on how we can build more resilience on us. And I'm curious to see

Sam Chandler (19:34.464)
Yeah.

Sam Chandler (19:37.939)
Absolutely.

Yes. It really is. And we're going to see disruption. And the topic and the title of this episode on how we can build more resilience on us. And I'm curious to see how do you think...

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (20:02.264)
How do you think the customer support of the future or the customer success, customer experience, overall customer service of the future will be about? How do you build resilience on those things, for example?

Sam Chandler (20:05.227)
the customer support of the future or the customer success, customer experience, overall customer service of the future will be about, right? What type of, how do you be resilient on those things, for example? Yeah. Okay. So this is where I'm going to talk very close into the microphone. I'm going to look very much into the camera because I am talking to every one of our support leader friends and colleagues. This is very, very important.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (20:31.47)
Hmm.

Sam Chandler (20:35.403)
This is happening. regardless of what we think about it, this is a huge disruptor, as you just said. The best thing that you can do is prepare yourself with the knowledge, understand how to leverage this technology instead of it leveraging you. So for example, if you're not learning prompt engineering, go find a place to do it.

If you don't understand what a GPT is, you know, if the letters LLM don't mean anything to you, you kind of understand what open AI is. Like I highly encourage you, whether you fully agree with this path we're going towards or not, arming yourself with information is the most important piece of it. So I do worry that with this question of like,

know, who is adopting AI, like, are we, you know, are we actually adopting these products yet? We will find the formula will happen. It will happen. And it will be best for anybody in support to be ready to go and understand how to leverage it. Those were the folks that will not be left behind.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (21:54.786)
Yes.

Sam Chandler (21:54.953)
I hope they're all listening. I hope everybody out there is listening. Go arm yourself with knowledge and information and get creative on how to use it.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (22:03.598)
Yeah, don't wait until it's too late, because this is part of what makes us human-humans. Sometimes we have to face challenges and live events that we are not prepared for, that we don't want to face, but it's not an option not to take action in times of AI, right?

Sam Chandler (22:05.255)
too late and because this is part of what makes us human humans sometimes we have to face

Sam Chandler (22:18.251)
face, but it's not an option not to take action. We have to build our stress wood. That's what we're doing right now.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (22:27.288)
Correct. Yes, absolutely, absolutely. Thanks for bringing that up, Sam. I'm going to make a stop. I'm getting my, something is coming back to my audio when I speak.

Sam Chandler (22:35.915)
Yeah, stop. I'm getting...

Sam Chandler (22:43.019)
is coming back to my audio when I speak. Do you think it's me?

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (22:49.145)
Can you maybe mute yourself? Let me mute yourself real quick.

Sam Chandler (22:52.011)
Can you maybe mute yourself? Let me mute yourself real quick. Okay.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (23:00.472)
Hello? Hello?

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (23:05.622)
Yeah. Hello? Yeah, now when I open your mic, I hear my voice back, like an echo.

Sam Chandler (23:06.071)
Yeah. Hello? Yeah, now when I open your mic, I hear my voice back. Like an echo.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (23:22.559)
It's weird.

Sam Chandler (23:22.975)
It's weird.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (23:30.638)
somehow it says eco-cancellation and yours is turned off.

Sam Chandler (23:33.247)
It says eco-cancellation, yours is turn off. Mine is turn off, how about.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (23:41.112)
Do you have the ability to turn it back on?

Sam Chandler (23:41.473)
Do you have the ability to turn it back on? It says no, but it also says to turn it on if you're not wearing headphones. So I, I wonder if my headphones at some point turned off and that is maybe what did it. I didn't hear any echo at all though. I hear it here in in my.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (24:02.262)
I hear it here in mind. It's coming back. And it was good at the beginning, but at some point it started doing this.

Sam Chandler (24:07.785)
It's super weird. Let's see.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (24:20.782)
because my worry is that it puts on the recording, but it should not put the echo.

Sam Chandler (24:23.223)
on the recording but it shouldn't

Yeah, it's not letting me change any of my audio settings. I think it's because it's still recording. Yeah, yeah. Let's continue. I'll try to put this as little as possible so it goes.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (24:33.494)
Yeah, yeah, let's continue. I'll try to put this as little as possible so it doesn't interrupt.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (24:47.118)
All right, perfect. Yeah, Sam, I totally agree with you on that and extremely important that we start kind of building that resilience and we really invest, right, on learning and adapting what this future will be with AI. Because we like it or not, we want it or not, it's gonna be part of our life. It's gonna be embedded into our operations, into our workflows.

Sam Chandler (24:49.547)
Yes, and I totally agree with you that an extremely important that we start kind of building that resilience and we really invest, right, on learning and adopting what this future will be with AI. Because we like it or not, we want it or not, it's going to be part of our life. It's going to be embedded in our operations, into our workflows. Businesses are going to be looking to implement this more more.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (25:14.072)
Businesses are going to be looking to implement this more and more. We're going to be using it in our daily lives. So it's a very important advice that we all start using it and start learning to live with it.

Sam Chandler (25:17.783)
we're going to be using in our daily lives. So it's a very important advice that we all start using it and start learning to live with it. Absolutely. You know, I've heard CX leaders say before that, you know, the requirements of what they're being asked to do is different than what they signed up for. And that's probably true.

You know, like every, every job has an evolution. think of customer success when I first started versus now, and like even where I can see it's going in a couple of years and same with support. You know, if I think about when we first started adding self-service and knowledge bases, that completely changed how our agents were responding, what kinds of questions they were responding to. And so to me, I see this as the next evolution of, of support.

of the way, honestly, of how we interact with each other on so many different levels. just pretending that it's not happening or hoping that if nobody adopts it, that it's going to go away, that's probably not the best move. Even from just a business... Yeah. If you just think of a business standpoint, there is too much money invested in this for people to just take their balls and go home.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (26:31.23)
No, this should not be our strategy.

Sam Chandler (26:43.605)
You know, like it's, it's going to happen one way or another. And it's here, it's here. So we can do our best to make it, to make it as good as it can be. and, and make sure that we think through all of those, those pieces that maybe, you know, somebody that is focused on the technology and not the humanity. Like we can offer that into, into the conversation. And I hope that, that we do.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (26:43.832)
Yeah.

It's here. It's here.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (27:10.264)
Yeah, I hope that too. And it makes me think about the power of storytelling and community as we move forward, right? How powerful that will be to keep us connected and grounded, basically, as humans.

Sam Chandler (27:16.951)
Yeah, absolutely. How powerful that will be to keep us connected and grounded basically as humans. Storytelling. That will never go away. Even before we had words, before we have written language, we had stories. that will stay with us throughout whatever comes next.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (27:31.959)
Mm-hmm.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (27:38.06)
Yep, I totally agree, Sam. And you know, what's powerful about resiliency is that you're building for the future, right? And that's what's important today and in the future. It's that your resilience is what's going to make you evolve, right? And be able to survive whatever life throws at you, basically.

Sam Chandler (27:39.927)
and you know what's powerful about resiliency is that you're building for the future, right? And that's what's important today and in the future is that your resilience is what's gonna make you evolve, right? And be able to survive whatever life throws at you, basically. Absolutely, yeah. think back to, throwing it back to nature. You know, have...

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (28:08.824)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (28:09.271)
our human lifespan and then I think of geological time and for us what feels like a long time for the earth like you know it's laughing at us like that's that's a blink of an eye so if we think of resilience in that way what might feel like a really short or like a long time now is actually a very short amount of time and and you know seeing seeing through like what is the the next phase and and preparing yourself for that I think that's

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (28:19.982)
Yeah.

Sam Chandler (28:37.729)
That's the most important thing that we can do for ourselves and for each other. Absolutely. Sam, how do you think customers will react and

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (28:42.292)
Absolutely, Sam, how do you think customers will react and will evolve as we move forward with embedding AI more and more into the services we provide to them? How do you see that shift? And what are your thoughts on how customers will continue to engage with us?

Sam Chandler (28:56.236)
BAY

we provide to them. How do you see that shift?

on how customers will continue to engage with us now in times of AI. Yeah. You know what's really interesting is like,

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (29:10.667)
Now in times of AI.

Sam Chandler (29:18.103)
customers are already doing this, you know, and so we can think about how it will continue to evolve and I'm sure it will. I think that the companies that do it wrong are the ones that we focus on because that's where you can see, you know? So if I think through companies that know their customer base and they know their customer's appetite for interacting with technology or not and like,

That's really what user experience is. And like the way that you develop your products and your service and your journey, that is all about design and craftsmanship. And the companies that get that right are already doing it. And not only do we not care, but we welcome it. So I think through Amazon, any of the thing, but like specifically like Amazon and Netflix and Google.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (29:50.231)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (30:13.847)
10 years ago, I used to ask a room of people like, okay, tell me what AI you use, like how are you using AI on a daily basis? And they like, I would get really out there answers of like very complex things. And then I'm like, I used it to get over here with Google Maps, you know, and people are like, yeah, or it'd be like, you know, Netflix recommended a show to me based on the other things that that I've watched. so the better

that a company leverages not only AI, but just their tools and their arsenal, the intended user journey. Those are the companies that are already getting it right. the customer is not gonna go into Amazon and be like, you know what? They're using AI. This is awesome. The customers don't care about that. They're gonna be like, did I get my package? Did they have the...

the thing that I came on here to get. Did I get to my location using maps? I find a good movie that I wanted to watch? And the more that companies get that mix right, then the more accepting consumers will be of it.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (31:28.758)
It makes me think as I think I'm seeing different approaches, right? I'm seeing companies with full disclosure, you are talking to an AI or a bot. I'm seeing others not disclosing who you're talking to. And it makes me think about from a consumer point of view, does it really matters who I'm talking to?

Sam Chandler (31:29.171)
It makes me think as I think I'm seeing.

I've seen different approaches, right? I've seen companies with full disclosure.

AI or a bot, I'm seeing others not disclosing who you're talking to. And it makes me think about from a consumer point of view, does it really matter who I'm talking to? And from the business side, what are the implications and ramifications of disclosing to our customers who they're talking to? How do you see that balance happening?

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (31:58.902)
And from the business side, what are the implications and ramification of disclosing to our customers who they're talking to? How do you see that balance happening?

Sam Chandler (32:10.837)
That's a really wonderful question and more companies need to be thinking through this. I'm very excited to hear the term governance more this year than I have in years past. So early, like so many times companies are worried about again, the efficiency gains. How do I get to the end goal the fastest? And we usually don't stop and think about

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (32:21.848)
Hmm.

Sam Chandler (32:40.833)
Wait a second. What are the implications of this? And so that's, that's actually a really important one. All of the legality is behind this. And I think, for example, like there are some states in the U S where you have to disclose that you're talking to a bot. It will be interesting to see. Like if I think through regulatory things throughout business and commerce, how will this, you know, fold into that?

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (33:09.24)
play out, right?

Sam Chandler (33:10.857)
Yeah. And then, you know, even the sustainability element where, you know, there's, there's an impact to the environment on this as well, that people are starting to think through and ask questions about. So, you know, that's where the humanity comes in, you know, asking those questions instead of just figuring out how to get to the most efficient route. And I don't know the answers to any, anything, what it'll look like in a couple of years, but I am so excited that people are asking these questions and that we're, we're considering it.

Um, to your, was kind of a, like a, a huge answer to, uh, a very logistical question of like, do you think companies should, to me, it's always kind of coincided with their, their brand and their tone. And, uh, you know, I've seen companies really have fun with it, play around, uh, let the customer know that they're using a bot and, uh, and it, it's really fun. Um, there, there are other companies really interestingly enough, like.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (33:45.07)
High- high level.

Sam Chandler (34:08.023)
I've also been reading studies where AI is actually becoming a friend to humans. So there are opportunities to actually leverage that relationship in a positive way. So it really depends on your business and your consumer.

Just as long as you actually have a strategy behind one or the other and you've thought through the legal implications, that's what I'd recommend first and foremost. Is it legal what you're doing? That's a good rule of thumb in life.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (34:35.213)
Yeah.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (34:41.804)
Yeah. And that's where AI governance will come more and more into play. And it's extremely important to help us all kind of level the playing field, right? Through regulations, through laws, through, know, it's important that not only us consumers, companies are also following the same rules, right?

Sam Chandler (34:52.119)
Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. You know, it's it with technology, there's

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (35:08.622)
to help us get to this next phase of whatever the next stage with AI will be.

Sam Chandler (35:19.721)
Technology always sits on the edge of law because so often, before rules are even written, we've advanced past them. so keeping those on the same level will be absolutely imperative to ensuring that everybody is playing within the same rules, but also untold dangers.

that we could be doing to ourselves, to society. And that's again, like where the human element comes in to make sure that someone's thought through that instead of just, you know, gaining as much efficiency as possible to the point of extinction.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (36:01.922)
And it's going to be also interesting to see the human creativity playing on this formula of how companies are going to sell to customers that they're using AIs more and more, right? Because that's where the human creativity will come in. And there may be companies that they portray in a way that it may be funny to other customers, and they may like it, right? It all depends how they're going to work through that.

Sam Chandler (36:03.743)
seem to see the human creativity playing.

Peace.

Sam Chandler (36:15.383)
that they're using AI more

Yeah, yeah. It absolutely does. It absolutely does. you know, I always remind people that there are a variety of ways of using AI as well. So, you know, right now, I think that from a business, like a B2B standpoint,

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (36:40.663)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (36:47.093)
We are so excited to put the word, that slap the AI label on anything that we can. And that's great. Fantastic for us. I think it's because we're so proud that like we got it to work. know, it's like we did a thing.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (36:54.306)
Yeah.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (37:01.816)
We cannot find a word that we put AI in front of it or...

Sam Chandler (37:05.183)
I know, exactly. I always make this joke like peanut butter, now with AI. So if I view that from a consumer standpoint, there's actually studies that have been done recently that show that when you put the word AI in front of your product, it actually makes consumers less likely to buy it. So isn't that interesting? And it's because of the distrust of previous...

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (37:26.281)
that's interesting.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (37:32.323)
Mmm.

Sam Chandler (37:33.451)
you know, iterations of the AI just not working. so consumers are, kind of tired of this AI situation, but there's, there's this component where it, think Sequoia calls it the AI frontier where basically like when it starts working, it's no longer AI. So if we think about all of the, the technological advances that we've seen in the last decade, that technically that was artificial intelligence.

and we accepted it into our day-to-day because it was convenient and it added value to our lives. This will be the same way. I imagine that at a certain point, we'll either stop using the term AI to describe everything, or it will describe something that is still new and still being worked on. And all of the development that we've created will just be built into our products and we'll stop.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (38:26.37)
Right.

Sam Chandler (38:31.648)
We'll stop like bragging about it. It'll just be a thing we do.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (38:34.038)
Right. It's the AI fatigue is real, right? It's everyday, everyday news about AI in different shapes and forms. And sometimes for people to keep up with everything that is going on, right? From the enterprises, from OpenAI, from Meta, from everything that is happening behind the scenes, from governance, right? From regulatory measures. And it's hard to keep up with all that.

Sam Chandler (38:37.648)
The AI fatigue is real. It is so real. Yes. Yes. It's everyday.

Sam Chandler (38:47.283)
some time for people to keep up with everything that is going on right from the

You

Sam Chandler (38:59.543)
regulatory measures and it's hard to keep up with all that. really is. It really is. And it makes me wonder, does the common human need to keep up with all of that or do we just need to trust that the people who are building things have our best interest in mind? And I like to go with that perspective because one, it means that we trust one another to build things that are good for us.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (39:03.502)
It really is.

Sam Chandler (39:29.013)
But it also means that I'm the protector of my fellow humans. And I keep that humanity in mind to make sure that anything that I am building, anything I am advocating for, I can actually say like, no, this will make your life better instead of me just peddling it as a like, well, I guess it's fine. It seems safe. I don't know. I read the label. It's fine. So. Exactly.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (39:54.442)
Is it really? It's interesting that you bring the topic of trust, because that was one of the things that I was planning on discussing with you today, and get your perspective on. Because I'm also seeing people trusting every single answer that they get from ChatGPT or OpenAI without...

Sam Chandler (40:02.103)
things that I was planning on discussing with you today and get your perspective on. Because I'm also seeing people trusting every single answer that they get from shot GPT or opening eye without taking a look at it see if it is correct or not. Just copy and paste also won't help people, right? It's not about copy and paste. It's about using

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (40:19.288)
taking a look at it and see if it is correct or not. Just copy and paste also won't help people, right? SM, it's not about copy and paste. It's about using this technology, but you need to put in and you need to make sure that what you're getting, right, it's accurate. Because it all depends where the data is coming from.

Sam Chandler (40:31.223)
this technology, but you need to put in and you need to make sure that what you're getting, right? It's accurate. Absolutely. It all depends where the data is coming from. And sometimes the answers are not accurate based on what you are looking for. This is where the trust issue also may come into play. How do you see that part, Yeah, you know, it's interesting. I see it in the in the

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (40:43.114)
And sometimes the answers are not accurate based on what you are looking for. And this is where the trust issue also may come into play. How do you see that part, Sam?

Sam Chandler (41:00.467)
evolution of support teams, for example, and how they implement AI. So for example, most support teams are very apprehensive of fully deploying an AI agent to talk to their customers. That to them is the final frontier. As I work with companies who are deciding what part of AI do we deploy first, is it

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (41:07.32)
Hmm.

Sam Chandler (41:29.291)
the full on AI agent that's talking to our customers or is it a co-pilot that talks to our, that helps our agents? Yeah, like most companies that have both of those offerings, it's so interesting because they use the word easy and they're like, well, they're going to go with the co-pilot because it's easier to deploy. And that might be the case, but what I found in talking to the support teams that are using it,

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (41:36.368)
It helps the agent, right? Right.

Sam Chandler (41:58.079)
is it's not about ease. It's about the fact that they trust it. So they're building trust in working with it themselves before they unleash it on someone else. And it's, you know, in a way, like if we're thinking about, you know, our humanity and working with AI, I think that's, it's kind of nice. It's kind of almost poetic in a way where...

You know, we want to make sure we're testing it on ourselves because before we put that into action with a fellow human, we want to make sure it works. And I think that's lovely. I think so from that perspective, it makes sense, right? Yeah. Let me test it ourselves. Let's see if this is really what I would like to put in front of our customers. If this is really the help or the experience that I want our customers to be part of.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (42:30.36)
think so. From that perspective, it makes sense, right? Let me test it ourselves. Let's see if this is really what I would like to put in front of our customers. If this is really the help or the experience that I want our customers to be part of, right? By us kind of self-driving this technology first.

Sam Chandler (42:50.039)
Yeah, It's kind of self-driving, this technology first. Yeah, it's the quality. like, it speaks to, like, the reason that most support people are in support is because they care about other humans and they want the experience to be good. They're like, is this up to quality? Like, is this up to my quality standards before I let someone else use it? And that's fantastic. Yeah, yeah, I agree.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (43:04.76)
Mm-hmm.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (43:16.78)
Yeah, yeah, I agree. I agree. I think that's very lovely way of showing love for our customers, right? You see, we care of our customers. We really do, right? Even in times of AI.

Sam Chandler (43:26.167)
Trust is love. Yes. And that brings me to thinking about something that I'm also seeing, right? Because now that you put this and that you mentioned, you bring this in a way that I did not think about it before, because I thought...

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (43:35.016)
Interesting, Sam. Yeah, and that brings me to thinking about something that I'm also seeing, right? Because now that you put this and that you mentioned, you bring this in a way that I did not think about it before, because I thought for the most part, still on our support to your call, right? And some organizations were still hesitant of...

Sam Chandler (43:54.497)
with the most support still on our support still go, right? And some organizations were still hesitant of kind of implementing AI for customer service, right? Because in part, all the quality, but also the human factor, which is putting AI in a role that historically has been human being.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (44:03.884)
kind of implementing AI for customer service, right? Because in part, all the quality, but also the human factor, which is putting AI in a role that historically has been human being, right? And that's what makes me think about how we're gonna evolve as we move forward.

Sam Chandler (44:24.055)
And that's what makes me think about how we're going to evolve as we move forward and the power of really transforming ourselves and making sure that the time that we're going to be using human beings in the middle of the customer operations, it may be on ways that we did not think before.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (44:31.2)
and the power of really transforming ourselves and making sure that the time that we're going to be using human beings in the middle of a customer operations in maybe on ways that we did not think before because we were also busy and AI can help with the repetitive task and maybe we can find more valuable tasks for us to spend on our time on.

Sam Chandler (44:48.991)
Yeah, because we were also busy and AI can help with the repetitive tasks. Maybe we can find more valuable tasks for us to spend our time on. And that's what I really would like to think that's where the next step is. Yeah, I mean, especially if you are just getting your feet wet, you're just adopting. It's a perfect place to start. you know, we we care about.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (44:59.456)
And that's what I really would like to think that's where the next step is.

Sam Chandler (45:16.607)
about our human counterparts and we want to be that person to directly help them. And I, you know, I think back, you just made me think back to the effortless experience by Matt Dixon, which is, I will carry that book with me forever. I love it. But you know, one of the main topics, the main themes of that book is your customers don't want to talk to you.

And it's hard for us to hear because we think that, well, a customer wants to talk to us. They want to reach out to support. They want to talk to a human and they, that's, that's truly what they want. In actuality, humans, want our question to be answered because having a, a support issue in general is a, an interruption in what we were just doing. So.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (46:01.932)
Right.

Sam Chandler (46:09.117)
If we can get the answer in the most efficient way by talking to another human, then that's what we'll do. If we can get it by searching a knowledge base, that's what we'll do. And so what I encourage the organizations that I talk to, to think about is what is the best way to get the customer, your user, to the next phase of where you need them to be. And if AI, you can use an AI tool to do that, then you should absolutely do that.

If AI is going to be a roadblock for your customer to get their answer, then what are we doing? Like use it in a different way. Absolutely. For me, it's about what is it?

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (46:46.434)
Absolutely. For me, it's about what is it that is saving time for our customers, right? When a customer needs to get on a phone to talk to us about an issue, that's time that we're taking our customer from building something or adding value to their business, right? So what we have to think always, and I agree with you 200 % there, what is it that how we're going to find ways to provide

Sam Chandler (46:52.567)
Correct.

issue, that's time that we're taking our customer from, you know, building something or adding value to their business. Right. So what we have to think always, and I agree with you 200 % there is that what is it that how we're going to find ways to provide the type of assistant that our customer is looking for in a way that continue to add value to our relationship. And that's via the human being or the chatbot, right?

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (47:14.69)
the type of assistant that our customer is looking for in a way that continue to add value to our relationship. And that's via the human being or the chat bot, right? Whatever we think, it will be better for our customer.

Sam Chandler (47:27.307)
whatever we think it will be better for our customers. Absolutely. Well, you know, I have this resource that I created to help guide people through this discovery on their own, because we tend to think of AI as just chat bots, whether it's a co-pilot to help us or whether it's an AI agent for our customers.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (47:48.814)
Mmm.

Sam Chandler (47:53.729)
But there are so many other flavors of AI that you could be leveraging. an example, like to help with reporting, I think about all of the times that I used to, and sometimes still do, sift through data. like, I love to sift through metadata because I'm a nerd, but you know, like, it's time consuming. And like these patterns that like you can,

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (48:09.358)
Mmm.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (48:13.646)
It's time consuming, right?

Sam Chandler (48:22.431)
you can achieve and understand in a way that you wouldn't necessarily have been able to before. Like I think back to and support, you know, we, often have like a field to on our forums. called it the about field and like you, you, what is your, what is your question about? And so it's like, well, I don't know what it's about. Let me just tell you. And then, you know, you can decide what it's about. Like think through all of the data and insight that we can get on things like that.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (48:41.635)
Bye.

Sam Chandler (48:51.915)
where we can put that back into the user journey and improve the journey by eradicating that question for them. I hope that more companies start leveraging AI for things like that, in addition to all of the cool things you can do with AI agents. Yeah, data analytics, insights, right? It's AI will help you tremendously. Absolutely. Even looking at patterns.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (49:11.298)
Yeah, data analytics, insights, It's AI will help you tremendously, right? Even looking at patterns and trying to anticipate what the next question or the next issue may be, right? And this is some of the good things that we also need to discuss and talk about AI, because it's not only bad things or concerns, there is a lot of value.

right, that AI will bring to our lives if we use it in a way that will add value to what we need, right? Basically. Yeah. Yeah.

Sam Chandler (49:44.998)
And that's where the humanity comes in is understanding where

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (49:50.99)
What is it that we need, right? Till today, we are the one that needs what we need from each other, right? And what our other fellow human beings also need.

Sam Chandler (49:51.425)
to do that within our lives. Totally agree. What is it that we need? Until today, we are the one that needs what we need from each other. Yeah. And what our other fellow human needs also need. No, it's beautiful. I agree. Sam, going to the last segment of today's episode, it's a question that I also ask every single guest. And it has kind of...

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (50:06.158)
Sam, going to the last segment of today's episode, it's a question that I also ask every single guest, and it has kind of multiple parts, it's the same question, but four different groups, right? And I'm going to start with the first one. What is it one piece of advice that you would provide to our fellow human beings that haven't started working with AI just yet?

Sam Chandler (50:19.191)
multiple parts is the same question, but four different groups, right? Yeah. Now, I'm going to start with the first one. What is it one piece of advice that you would provide to our fellow human beings that haven't started working with AI just yet? Yeah. Ooh. So I like to think of this question in terms of like five years from now, 10 years from now. And like,

If I think through to the high school students that are, you know, maybe freshmen in high school and what will it look like for them? I think that interestingly enough, like two different paths. One, either learn a trade, learn a trade, whether that's farming or HVAC systems or working on cars, learn to trade.

That's always going to be helpful. But then also I like to try to think through like, what is the next set of skills that is going to be needed for the technology? So while most people are like, I'm going to put this question in a chat GPT and I'm going to spit out an answer and it's going to be the exact same answer as everyone else. It's like, okay, what if I think through all of the ways to leverage AI,

what job can I build? What skill set can I do that will require all of those things? like those are, again, I'm a nerd. That's a fun little game I play with myself is like, okay, could you build an app to do X, Y, and Z based on what people need? So that's what I would say is like, again, learning, really understanding the technology, the benefits, the disadvantages and determining like what...

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (52:01.706)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (52:14.357)
What does your skill set, like where do you fit into that and where do you want to fit in and do you want to fit into it and what can you do if not? So that's what I would say.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (52:24.13)
Yeah, that makes sense. Thank you. And what would be a piece of advice for companies going through evaluating if AI fits their business needs or daily operations?

Sam Chandler (52:25.207)
And what would be a piece of advice for companies going through evaluating if AI fits their business needs or daily operations? Yeah. I would say just think of your consumer. Think of who is the persona that you are building this for and build it for them.

The example I always use is, I don't know if you remember the Jennifer Coolidge Discover ad from the Superbowl a few years ago, but I just, I love her so much. She's amazing. And she's so great. The one where she's like, how do I know if I'm a robot? So she's so relatable. And like, it was just such a great example of Discover knowing their customer base. And that was a moment where

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (53:03.362)
It's probably funny though.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (53:09.422)
She's so relatable. Yeah.

Sam Chandler (53:20.945)
everybody else is leading into AI. If we go down the highway in San Francisco from the airport to downtown, you blink and you see 50 of these AI billboards that nobody understands. then Discover is like, no, we know our consumer base and they're not feeling that right now. So they leaned into the fact that they were human. And I bring that up as an example because I know within Discover,

They're using AI in a variety of ways, but they listened to their customer and they understood what their customer wanted and needed. And they're using it in ways that, that benefits their customer journey instead of just throwing a bot at the problem, which I just thought was so lovely. Very smart. You're going to make me take a look at the app once we're done today.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (54:07.298)
Very smart, very smart. You're gonna make me take a look at that ad once we're done today, because now I want to go and watch.

Sam Chandler (54:17.407)
It's so good. And there was just a whole series of that. She's just the best. But yeah, I would say like companies really should understand their user base. And that goes for everything, whether it's AI or any decision. One of the top 20 reasons that startups fail to go from seed stage to series A is a lack of product market fit. That's from not knowing your customer base and what they need.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (54:39.982)
Hmm.

Sam Chandler (54:43.969)
that there's always a job to be done. There's always a value to sell know what that is before you go build something.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (54:50.126)
Brilliant, absolutely brilliant. Thank you, Sam. A piece of advice for governments. What would you like to tell governments that they need to focus and work on in times of AI?

Sam Chandler (55:02.631)
That regulation element, gosh, it's gonna be so important. I would say.

something that's, this is not a political statement, is something I've noticed within governments is that they don't have a great track record of keeping up with technology. And not only does that hinder them from what they're able to achieve for their constituents, but also when something harmful comes up, they don't have the knowledge that they need to be armed with in order to make an informed decision.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (55:20.43)
Mm-hmm.

Sam Chandler (55:36.725)
So I'll use Twitter as an example. Twitter is fine, and now it's X, but like back in the day when it was Twitter, I remember that people would, you know, there were threats that would happen on Twitter. People would go to a police station and try to explain the situation, and it was so new that the police didn't understand what that was. So there's a real, like, if we don't think through the governance,

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (55:41.528)
Hey.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (55:50.35)
Hmm.

Sam Chandler (56:05.331)
and the education of the people who govern us, then that could be a huge issue if we can't make informed decisions based on new technologies that are coming in.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (56:15.894)
Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. And last but not least, what would be your piece of advice for a younger Sam? Right? If you look back, but Sam is joining us today, so that would be a piece of advice for your younger Sam reflected on the future generations. What would you tell her?

Sam Chandler (56:20.311)
And last but not least

Sam Chandler (56:30.967)
If you look back, what Sam is joining us today. So that would be a piece of advice for your younger Sam reflected on the future generations. What would you tell her? Yeah, you know, I, in the matrix, there is no spoon. That's what I learned from the matrix. And I think that just doing things.

You know, we put these boundaries on ourselves of, well, I can't do that. Or I'm not allowed. you know, legal, let's say within the law, of course, you know, not saying to do anything illegal, but like, I think we put a lot of those boundaries on ourselves when there's no actual law or fence or rule keeping us from doing these things. So that's what I would say. It's just...

See where you can push your own limits just a little bit and see what fun you can create and what amazing things you can do. Beautiful. We need more doers, right? We more doers. We need more of those. Absolutely. Yeah. yeah. So, Sam, it's been a pleasure, my friend. Thanks for sharing your time and your insights, right? Your humanity with us. And I really appreciate you.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (57:39.352)
Beautiful. We need more doers, right? We need more of those, absolutely. So Sam, it's been a pleasure, my friend. Thanks for sharing your time, your insights, your humanity with us. I've really appreciated you and your wisdom with us today and for taking the time and spend this precious.

Sam Chandler (58:00.151)
and your wisdom with us today and for taking the time and spend this precious time with us. So from the bottom of my heart, really thank you, okay? Thank you so much for having me. Like I said, this has been such an honor and I am just so thrilled to be here. Great.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (58:06.584)
time with us. So from the bottom of my heart, really thank you. Okay.

THE HUMAN PROTOCOL PODCAST (58:17.698)
Great, thank you. And if today's conversation sparks something in you, share this episode with your family, your friends, your loved one. Follow the human protocol and join us every week as we explore what does it take to stay human while building the future with AI. Thanks for joining us today and see you next time. Bye, everyone.

Sam Chandler (58:23.191)
share this episode with your family, your friends, your

Sam Chandler (58:32.887)
as we explore what does it take to stay human while building the future with AI. Thanks for joining us today and see you next time. Bye everyone.